Are We Over Gay People Yet?: Philosophy Forums

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Are We Over Gay People Yet?

BadLuck
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Posted 04/12/04 - 07:13 PM:	#1
Okay. I know this is a fairly large topic in the upcoming election and all but I was wondering about peoples views on the matter of homosexuality. 1. Gay marriage? 2. Laws banning sodomy? 3. And while we're at it Polygamy? (just to stir things up a bit) By the way if anyone brings up "The bible", "God says", "My religion" I will ignore your opinions outright. (unless you make a good point, but I doubt it)

VT Math02
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Posted 04/12/04 - 07:40 PM:	#2
As nice as it would be to just do away with these laws and let people do what they want, I don't think our society is ready for that right now. How long ago did we do away with slavery? And look at the problems with race that we still have. Even today an interracial couple still struggles with a certain negative stigmata. I see a parallel between this and the gay's struggle. I don't think our culture can handle it now. Doesn't mean you can't work to try and get it changed, but don't get your hopes up. It doesn't seem like this will be fixed anytime soon.
It is not once nor twice but times without number that the same ideas make their appearance in the world. -Aristotle

VT Math02
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Posted 04/12/04 - 07:41 PM:	#3
As far as Polygamy goes, that should be legal, but just for men.
It is not once nor twice but times without number that the same ideas make their appearance in the world. -Aristotle

SudsMcDuff
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Posted 04/12/04 - 07:47 PM:	#4
1. Civil Unions. 2. Nah. 3. No polygamy 4 me thx Religion is most of the reason why people are against things like this.
"I've seen your flag on the marble arch Love is not a victory march It's a cold and it's a broken Hallelujah.." -- Rufus Wainwright

Socrastein
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Posted 04/12/04 - 09:24 PM:	#5
1. I've yet to hear a single valuable argument against it, and only dozens for it. Humans need to grow up. Even the religious arguments are full of contradictions and bigotry. 2. That doesn't even have anything to do with same-sex relations, so no. You can have sodomous anal sex between a hetero sexual couple. Ask Piramni 3. Polygamy leads to exploitation and a whole lotta "getting left out" for lack of a better phrase. Humans can barely maintain a healthy one-way relationship, much less 3 or 9 way. Marriage is and should be about two individuals who love eachother very much, unless of course the relationship is somehow unhealthy or exploitative (the woman who's husband beats her would say she loves him, but that's not what marriage should be about) Many people argue that gay marriage will lead to polygamy, but that is ridiculous and fallacious, because I've never hear a logical connection created directly between the two, and of course that makes it the slippery-slope fallacy. Funny how popular it is TiggerMcDrunk wrote: 1. Civil Unions. I hate the term civil unions. Perfect example of history repeating itself, and great example of how oblivious humans are to repeating past mistakes. If you're wondering what I'm talking about, I ask you if the phrases "Civil rights movement" and "separate but equal" mean anything to you.
"The time has come for people of reason to say enough is enough. Religious faith discourages independent thought, it's devisive, and it's dangerous." -Richard Dawkins

FtheNaysayers
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Posted 04/12/04 - 09:54 PM:	#6
Socrastein wrote: I hate the term civil unions. Perfect example of history repeating itself, and great example of how oblivious humans are to repeating past mistakes. If you're wondering what I'm talking about, I ask you if the phrases "Civil rights movement" and "separate but equal" mean anything to you. Yes, but you I don't think we can actually compare the Civil Rights movement to the Gay Rights movement when discussing same-sex marriages. After all the people arguing for civil rights had a stronger case because skin color-- unlike sexual preference--is something you are born with. Now I am not saying that there aren't any homosexuals by genetics, but I believe this to be true for a very small minority. And I am also not saying that they shouldn't be allowed to marry--just that we can't make the Civil Rights movement equal to the Gay Rights movement when same-sex marriage is the topic. So it is not "history repeating itself" per se.

leucrotta
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Posted 04/12/04 - 10:02 PM:	#7
Gay Marriage- yep. Sodomy Laws- no. Polygamy- no.
if no body speaks of remarkable things...

Socrastein
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Posted 04/12/04 - 10:38 PM:	#8
After all the people arguing for civil rights had a stronger case because skin color-- unlike sexual preference--is something you are born with. Now I am not saying that there aren't any homosexuals by genetics, but I believe this to be true for a very small minority. Well how bout this, nobody is genetically Christian, but we have religious tolerance. It doesn't make the gays' case any less strong if some of them choose to be gay, which I don't think is even true.
"The time has come for people of reason to say enough is enough. Religious faith discourages independent thought, it's devisive, and it's dangerous." -Richard Dawkins

Baron Max
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Posted 04/13/04 - 03:16 AM:	#9
BadLuck wrote: 1. Gay marriage? While we're at it, I think we should be permitted to marry our favorite goats and sheep and dogs, too. Me and my sheep are in love and should not be discriminated against just 'cause of her looks or how she walks on four legs! I also think that the laws against incest should struck down. If we approve the marriages for gays, lesbians and goats/sheep, then it's only right and logical to allow siblings/relatives to marry. Oh, and laws should be changed to allow humans marry apes, too! BadLuck wrote: 2. Laws banning sodomy? All great, civilized nations should have laws written plainly on their books which state that men should be permitted to stick their penises into the assholes of other people ...asshole fucking should be legal and socially acceptable! BadLuck wrote: 3. And while we're at it Polygamy? I think women should be permitted to have as many husbands as they want. As for men? I'm still open-minded, but I think that, somehow, he should have to prove that he can provide for them and the resultant children. Baron Max

BadLuck
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Posted 04/13/04 - 06:26 AM:	#10
Baron Max wrote: While we're at it, I think we should be permitted to marry our favorite goats and sheep and dogs, too. Me and my sheep are in love and should not be discriminated against just 'cause of her looks or how she walks on four legs! That's a great idea but I don't most people would be very accepting of the idea. Unfornunately it is one of the mores that is so deeply inbedded in our culture it will be very hard to get people to see otherwise. Baron Max wrote: I also think that the laws against incest should struck down. If we approve the marriages for gays, lesbians and goats/sheep, then it's only right and logical to allow siblings/relatives to marry. Oh, and laws should be changed to allow humans marry apes, too! Yeh the incest thing bothers me too. I mean when it comes down to it does it really matter if you love a member of your family that way? But sadly that is one of the few univesal mores common in every culture. It seems the only logical way to explain that incest is okay is just for someone to except the idea. Baron Max wrote: All great, civilized nations should have laws written plainly on their books which state that men should be permitted to stick their penises into the assholes of other people ...asshole fucking should be legal and socially acceptable! Well, there are laws saying that 'asshole fucking' is illegal, so why not laws that say it's okay. But 'asshole fucking' is not the only form of sodomy there is. Sodomy also includes oral sex, the use of condoms, and birth control. So a law doesn't need to say 'asshole fucking' just sodomy. But then why are laws concerned about the way people recieve personal pleasure anyway? Baron Max wrote: I think women should be permitted to have as many husbands as they want. As for men? I'm still open-minded, but I think that, somehow, he should have to prove that he can provide for them and the resultant children. Baron Max Well, polygamy in same-sex relationships do not result in children therefore there is no need for concern with them. As for het couples wouldn't more parents be better? And the tax benifits from marriage would come in handy in polygamous relationships. You also get a larger amount of family income. I would now like to bring up the topic of same-sex adoption. Any thoughts about that?

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