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Was it Language that formed Consciousness?

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Was it Language that formed Consciousness?

wuliheron
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Posted 05/20/09 - 01:53 AM:	#11
There are all kinds of different definitions for the word consciousness, including quite elaborate technical ones used by scientists. However, in general, a few animals like elephants show very clear signs that they are aware of themselves and the feelings of other elephants in their group. Elephants will circle their dead and shed tears for days. They also appear to recognize their reflection in a mirror as themselves. For about a million and half years or so people possessed the same primitive technology of fire and rudamentary stone tools. Then about eighty thousand years ago this suddenly changed. People developed complex tools, art, and in general progressed rapidly. Most archeologists believe this rapid change was fueled by the development of language. In studies of chimps two basic behaviors seem to differentiate them from humans. One is that they apparently have no impulse control. They remain dangerous to even the closest of their handlers. Although they seem to understand the idea of delayed gratification, they will always eat an immediate reward even when told if they wait they will receive a larger reward. The other behavior chimps seem to lack is any desire to teach their young. Their young learn by watching them, but the parents seem uninterested in their progress. Human children, in comparison, quickly learn the simple task of pointing at things and their parents tend to show interest in sharing their children's desire to learn and share what they learn. Both of these behaviors involve the frontal cortex which helps us to control our impulses and is considered the seat of higher reasoning and personality. When combined with complex language skills technological progress became possible. However, it seems consciousness has been erroniously put on a pedestal by some philosophers and many religions as a uniquely defining characteristic of humanity.

Minyun
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Posted 05/22/09 - 09:10 AM:	#12
When you have a thought to do something, like get out of the way of something that is coming at you, then I believe this is born out of instinct, the subconcious. Does a bird, when it mimics your voice through repition make use of language? Does it comprehend that when it makes a certain sound a certain thing will happen? If I cherped to my bird "polly want a cracker?" and it repeated it in the hopes that it would be fed, then I would say it was making use of language. Does the bird have consciousness? I don't think so, perhaps it has a subconscious, an instinct. I think language is independant of consciousness' development. I was thinking that maybe, the first being to evolve with eyes would be the first to develop consciousness (through percieving reflection of itself) or maybe I should go so far as to say the first being to evolve senses would be the first to develop consciousness. Only with senses can we make sense of the world, we make sense of the world through our consciousness. I think it would be best if we defined what consciousness is.

Melancholicus
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Posted 05/24/09 - 05:01 AM:	#13
Minyun wrote: "If I cherped to my bird "polly want a cracker?" and it repeated it in the hopes that it would be fed, then I would say it was making use of language. Does the bird have consciousness? I don't think so, perhaps it has a subconscious, an instinct." I would definietly say that the bird has a consciousness. If one makes it a routine to say a certain sound and then feed it, the bird would recognize the sound as a signal for food. It is aware that the sound indicates food and therefore it must be conscious.

wuliheron
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Posted 05/24/09 - 05:30 AM:	#14
The African Grey parrot has been studied extensively and proven to understand the meaning of many words. Edited by Bobard on 06/22/09 - 12:52 AM. Reason: removed flame

Minyun
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Posted 05/24/09 - 08:14 AM:	#15
So does the bird then have a consciousness? Then are we to say that anything that has the capacity to learn also has the capacity for consciousness? Regardless of language. Maybe it was this learning that inspired consciousness. This ability to evolve.

GonzophotographyInc.
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Posted 06/15/09 - 04:56 AM:	#16
Using the example of an emergency situation to prove consciousness without language doesn't really work. In such an instinctual situation, the reason one does not think in langusage terms is beacause one does not think at all consciously. One's fear and desire to move are automic subconsious responses, instinct, which is different. The question at hand involves consciousness, rather than the subconscious. I believe consciousness does exist without and before language- as literate people we find it hard to think without the useful tool of language, and it certainly enhances our capacity for abstract thought. This has been documented by several individuals born death and blind who have since learnt to communicate through the tactile. They definitely were conscious beings, able to form ideas and think, but when they learnt language they report their ability to comprehend was greatly assisted. Examples are unneccesary though, for as I'm sure you have, I occasionally think without language. One has to be in a very distant mood to do this, and I've only ever done it accidentally, lapsing back into language when I realise. Instead of language, thought can exist purely as associations of emotional experience. For example, at a bar I may be attracted to a girl and feel compelled to go talk to her (although of course I cannot think of what I'll say until I go back to using language), but because I feel attached to a different girl it warrants several abstract computations that colour my thoughts very dominately, but which become incomprehendable and intangible immediately after. I am not referring to simple instinctual conflict, rather, a more conscious process of thought which exists without language, but which is translated into language terms with any attempt to analysis.

TheThoughtfulOne
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Posted 06/17/09 - 11:15 AM:	#17
Melancholicus wrote: I am not sure if consiousness has been developed through language, since it is two different subjects. The "early man" was equipped with the very same consiousness as modern man and thus the same ability to know what feels right and wrong. Language was developed to communicate and organize, to form rules. But im not sure if it relates to consiousness. I agree.
I am what I am, but what am I? - Me

PsychVegas
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Posted 06/18/09 - 10:00 PM:	#18
I would submit consciousness emerged out of communication. I also agree with ManiacJack that it is to some extent a chicken and egg argument. Many believe it is an adaptation for survival. Those that were able to think about consequences of their actions, e.g. if I throw a rock at the lion it will eat me, survived. I take the view that we owe our consciousness to our thumbs. It was by having thumbs we were able to develop tool use and from tool use symbols. From symbols we began to relate sounds to the symbols which formed language. It was from symbols/language we were for the first time able to reflect on past, present, and future. By being able to communicate concepts relative to time consciousness became a necessary ability that aided the reflection process. It was not a dichotomy, you could reflect or not reflect, but instead some were able to process and reflect more effectively than others and therefore alter their actions and survive to reproduce. Primates and other animals may have tool use, but have not yet achieved production of communication through symbols. And if rudimentary communication through symbols exists it has not yet translated to language.

cosscos
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Posted 06/21/09 - 07:59 AM:	#19
I think consciousness is the power which is able to represent things into the mind. When a man represent something in his mind it is impossible apart from signs. Yes, language is the one of those signs for bring up represntation in his mind. So, the language is a tool on behalf of conscioussness.

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